Thanks for all your help. I manually did an update just before this message and it said the antivirus/antispyware was up to date, the it gave me an error unable to install. Then I checked the number of the DAT file and it had indeed increased to 1031951264. Then I ran a manual update again and again it said antivirus/antispyware was up to date, bu this time it gave no error message. I will be playing with this a little.